Hewlett-Packard has agreed to provide real Windows CDs to its customers instead of hiding the Windows files in a recovery partition, Engadget reports this morning:
If you’re the owner of an HP PC purchased over the past few years, you may just be in line for a free Windows XP recovery CD, based on the settlement of a class-action lawsuit brought against HP over, of all things, hidden recovery partitions and missing Windows XP directories. The main allegations in the case, which was settled without HP admitting any wrongdoing, were that HP included undisclosed recovery partitions on PC hard drives, and didn’t include the “ValueAdd” and “Support” folders that are included on standalone copies of XP.
The Engadget editors didn’t include a link (update – in the comments, Mark Orchant points out that the link is there, although it’s so cleverly hidden that no human being would ever find it), so I can’t track down the source of the story. As of this morning, MSN Money had nothing on this story, and neither did Yahoo! Finance.
Anyway, this is good news. If you use Windows XP, you should have a Windows CD. Period. (One good reason: In Windows XP Home Edition, the Windows Backup program is in the Support folder and isn’t installed by default. Backup is a good thing.)
Obligatory Dell reference: I noticed when pricing the latest Dell configurations last week that Dell will now sell home users a Windows CD. That’s right – if you want the CD, you have to pay an extra $10 for it. They’re shameless.
Ed Bott 
I can’t understand why manufacturers mess around with these hidden partitions. CDs are cheap, why not just include one?
Ed:
Here’s the link.
It actually is at the bottom of the post under the “Read” link. We’re having a raging debate internally at WIN right now about renaming that link to make it clearer.
I recently bought a new Sony Vaio laptop with the same issue – no recovery CDs. It has a utility that guides you though making the back up CDs, all 5 of them. They have a backup DVD available to order from their website – $12. For the price of the laptop, you’d think it would include the back up CDs or DVD.
Ryan, I couldn’t agree more. When I buy a new PC, the first thing I do is wipe the drive and start over. 🙂 I’m very particular about what does, and does not, go on my hard drive.
My most recent PC had one of these hidden partitions. I simply bought a new copy of XP Professional and used it to wipe the drive, including the hidden partition.
If there’s one thing I wish Microsoft would use its monopoly power to do, it is to REQUIRE computer manufacturers to provide a Windows CD with every computer!
Speaking of the $10 Dell Windows CD. When I ordered my Dell Notebook, I’m 99% certain that I selected that option. Yet it didn’t appear on my invoice and (of course) I didn’t receive it.
In a phone conversation yesterday, I was told that Dell doesn’t ship Windows CDs for that computer. I guess they didn’t get around to updating their Web order form yet. But, as I learned, if you call tech support they’ll send you one — at least the guy I talked to promised to send me one.
Ryan, CDs are cheap, but it is cheaper for OEMs to just put the files on your hard drive.
Also, many users misplace their CDs.
I think though that it’s patronising of manufacturers to imply we are all incapable of looking after our software.
My version of XP pro was found to be invalid the other day on the win update site but it offered me the chance of legalising it by paying £97. I can’t find that link anymore – does anyone know where it is?
Just bought a Dell Inspiron 6000, not only do the files come on a hidden partition and not on CD, but they removed the utility that allows you to make the CD yourself!! Now the only way is to get one from Dell Support! Give me a break.
I feel your pain Tom (the guy above me). Same situation here. The other slap in the face is that their website still claims you can burn one copy of the OS. You can’t, as far as I know. Grrr…
I have an hp pavillion 7935 (I’ve upgraded it a lot) and I hate that every time that I reformat I get all of HP’s CRAPWARE on my system. Where do I go to get one of those cd’s from HP?
I just bought a Dell 9100 here in the UK. Not only did I not get a Windows CD, the partition on the 160gig hard drive was 15gig, leaving me 145gig! After a week or two….they make it hard to contact live support, they have promised to send a disc, which I need to install in order to wipe, whatever takes up 15gig space? off my drive.
I have just bought a Dell Inspiron 6000 and only after one week with it I realize that it would be a good idea reinstall the windows and tune it under my necessities, I mean removing all unwanted software… so.. where is the windows CD ? it wasn’t there … gee!!! I bought a $1200 laptop and it does not come with a CD ??? ok … use the program to generate by yourself as stated at Dell’s website… but again … where is the program… it didn’t come with my laptop !!! wow!!! and then surfing at Google I found out this page with these good posts… I wish I had read it before doing my laptop purcharse…
But does anyone knows how to do a CD using any partition reader software that can see the hidden partition ?
Thanks,
Rogerio.
La Palma, California
“where is the program… it didn’t come with my laptop !”
It is on a hitten restore partition. Reboot hit CTRL=F11 and it will enter the restore utility. Try ptedit (Symantec, free) to see and manipulate (careful!) the partition tables, the Utility partition is (really) a FAT16 that got hidden by changing the type from 06 to DE, it contains the Utility disk, drivers and such. The 2nd Partition is NTFS (type 08, boot set to 80, active), where XT is loaded and the third partition is (really) a FAT32 with the type changed from type 0C to DB, that is where a symantec backup (ghost) image is. I am working on it now but having difficulties cloning the drive, different manufacturers, one is IDE, the other SATA (original) but will dig through it once I am sure I am not going to damage too much, I am reluctant to change the MBR on the original drive to un-hide the partitions and copy them without being REAL SURE, some bits and pieces of the process (with testing, but using freeware and various HD utilities) aren’t lining up cleanly, yet. Dell 9100, XP SP2
Hello Ed,
Thanks for the information regarding the hidden partition on WindowsXP. When I first bought my PB iMedia 5094 three years ago, I tried a backup but all I got was ‘No backup partition’. At the time I did not understand what that meant, thinking all was safe in some sort of hidden drive???
Now, I when I try to open SmartRestore I get ‘missing file’. Obviously as I have no backup, I cannot reinstall the utility . Nevertheless, I contacted Packard Bell in the UK. They wanted nothing to do with it and said it is my problem and that I have to purchase the CD set at around £40 (about $60)
Does anyone have any update on this query?
Many thanks
Frank
Scotland
I’m amazed at what supposedly savvy computer users will put up with. Why are you guys still buying from Dell, HP, etc.? They stay up late every night thinking of ways to stick it to you. Meanwhile, there are tons of independent pc builders dying for customers. When you factor in the improved quality of the components, the service, the support, and the actual MS Windows cd, you won’t pay any more, and you’ll be a lot happier.
thanks for the good tip Brett!!
Sorry just dont wanna post my addy here. But wife got me a dell for christmas. Rental from local rent-2-own place. No CD, got the Dell recovery app. used it. dispappeared.
Nice thing about THIS ‘book is that it’s got Windows “GO BACK” Feature. that resets your system back to a previous time and date. Used IT, rebooted, App came back, but for real? I’m not sure, but it had the Eula, so maybe it did.
Anyway about the partitions, thanks for the tip. couldn’t see what exactly what was on them, till I used my Knoppix CD, then I could see them.
I am still debating if and how I can back up the entire laptop drive. Might have to hook it inot my other box using a laptop drive dongle to gender-size it to normal ide, but still I am nervous cuz it’s a RENTAL!
The only thing they got on there is dell’s crap (1st and 3rd partitions) and on the NTFS part, XP home, with WORDPERFECT office 10 (with only wordperfect), as well as dells crap.
I don’t know, how I should proceed, burn the whole ghosted drive to a dvd, with a note saying change back part codes or what?
Please advise.
The new Dell xps m140 that I bought for my wife and daughter for Christmas crashed after 28 days. First of many surprises from Dell was I was 7 days past the 21 day no questions asked period for replacement so the telemarketers in India began shipping refurbished parts (hard drive than sent to depot for system board)in my new computer. Not enough time to descibe the commedy of errors and the total overall failure of Dell Support to correct these issues but one thing is very clear. They don’t care!
Back to “no os & system cd” surprises. I fully expected the system to work as purchased when it was returned to me after repairs from Dell. Are you kidding! No opperating system no utilities! You got it…….back to telemarketers in India……to no avail after 4hours partitioning, loading os & utilities,troubleshooting errors in hardware device manager IDE and modem driver..They want to ship it back to depot and replace yet another system board. Damm these guys are good…..not.( maybe they were really asleep and sleep talking in the phone.It was 3am in India.)Hell no I did’nt send it back!
Here my question.( I’m not an IT guy but learning fast) I was able to clear all errors buy deleteing all partitions that had been created on hard drive. I am running everthing on C drive, no partitions. Is this taboo? Do I need to partition the drive? Should I try another install with partitions before I put laptop back in service? It took an act of congress and a little alkida to get them but I do have the OS and utility disc if I ever need to start from scratch again.
Thanks for any input.
Bill
I just bought an Inspiron E1505 with 40GB hard drive. But when I checked the Capacity on C drive, it shows only 31.1GB. It’s a new 40GB hard drive laptop, I haven’t done anything to it yet and I got only 12GB available left. So I called DELL and they told me about the hidden partion. Man, the hidden partition took up my other 9GB hard drive!!! I should have checked this before the 21days return period. Now I can’t return it. I’ve heard that if I install Pro XP, I can get rid of the hidden partition. Is this true? Do I need to back up every thing before I install XP Pro? I also heard that it’s kinda complicate to back up the hidden partition. Do I need to back up the hidden partion as well? Thanks.
Thanks to Brett (12/1/05) for the very detailed information about Dell’s hidden restore partitions.
Here is the information from some Dell Dimension 1100’s purchased earlier this month. According to Windows, here are the partitions:
1: 31MB FAT EISA (Diagnostic Utilities)
2: 52.71GB NTFS System (Main data partition)
3: 18.51GB NTFS Backup (Ghost Backup uses this)
4: 3.26GB FAT32 Unknown (Dell’s Recovery image)
(Don’t you love how the “80GB” HDD only has 52GB of usable space?)
According to PTEdit:
Type, Boot, Start Cyl, Hd, Sct, End Cyl, Hd, Sct, Before, Sectors
DE, 00, 0, 1, 1, 3, 254, 63, 63, 64197
07, 80, 4, 0, 1, 1023, 254, 63, 64260, 110543265
07, 00, 1023, 0, 1, 1023, 254, 63, 110607525, 38813040
DB, 00, 1023, 0, 1, 1023, 254, 63, 149420565, 6827625, 6827625
As in Bret’s case, the utility and recovery partitions were set to invalid types (DE and DB respectively). Using PTEdit32 (which allows you to make changes from within Windows XP; very cool!), I changed the types to 04 (FAT 16
I was too long-winded. If you would like to read the rest of my comment, including some interesting (scary?) observations made while booting into the recovery console, visit my blog entry at http://www.allogro.com/content/view/34/30/
I hope that Ed doesn’t mind me cross-posting like this. I hadn’t planned on doing so originally. 🙂
I aggree also these computer giants should include the actual software and not recovery disk. I have a Gateway 816 GM Media Pc. Creating the disks were not a problem. The problem is they do not work. You get the system running and the drivers do not load. You ask Gateway for help and they tell you try this, try that. nothing works. I do not think any one that has put together computers before ever had problems when they had the actual software.Not Recovery Software.
Is MAC any better? I’m seriously prepared to return a new Gateway laptop I bought for my college bound kid last weekend. It won’t let me make recovery DVD’s or CDROM’s…it keeps saying “No recovery partition found”, when D: is clearly labeled RECOVERY, and it has files in it. Very frustrating. I don’t want to depend on restoring from the recovery partition using F11, because frankly, that partition can become corrupted via viruses.
Seriously, is MAC better? I’m thinking of returning this POS and buying a MAC.
Can anybody tell me what is the hidden partition for a Dell XPS M140?.